? Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to happen and
the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock him points or
would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to happen and
the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock him points or
would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to happen and
the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock him points or
would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
On 6/12/2021 10:41 pm, Martin Harran wrote:
a Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to happen and
the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock him points or
would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
Going by the way he drove in Jeddah I'd say we only have to wait to find out.
Martin Harran <martinharran@gmail.com> wrote:
? Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to happen and
the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock him points or
would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
It depends. Look to '97 for a precedent.
-a Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to happen and
the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock him points or
would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to happen and
the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock him points or
would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
On Mon, 6 Dec 2021 23:09:11 +1300, ~misfit~
<shaun.at.pukekohe@gmail.com> wrote:
On 6/12/2021 10:41 pm, Martin Harran wrote:
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to happen and
the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock him points or
would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
Going by the way he drove in Jeddah I'd say we only have to wait to find out.
I was hoping that Lewis would go into the final race marginally ahead,
not because I want him to win the WDC - either of them will be a
worthy winner - but I get nervous of Max in this situation. I don't
think he would deliberately set out to do it but the one thing he has
not yet learned is how to control his red mist.
On Mon, 6 Dec 2021 23:09:11 +1300, ~misfit~
<shaun.at.pukekohe@gmail.com> wrote:
On 6/12/2021 10:41 pm, Martin Harran wrote:and >> the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock him points
a Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to happen
or >> would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
Going by the way he drove in Jeddah I'd say we only have to wait to
find out.
I was hoping that Lewis would go into the final race marginally ahead,
not because I want him to win the WDC - either of them will be a
worthy winner - but I get nervous of Max in this situation. I don't
think he would deliberately set out to do it but the one thing he has
not yet learned is how to control his red mist.
On 2021-12-06 1:41 a.m., Martin Harran wrote:
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to happen and
the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock him points or
would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
Given that the excluded Schumacher from the results of the WDC in
1997, there is clearly precedent (and presumably a rule) that would
allow them to do the same to Verstappen if they judged he
deliberately took himself and Hamilton out.
And with all of the telemetry available to them, the stewards would
be in a very good position to judge whether or not it was deliberate.
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 1:41 a.m., Martin Harran wrote:
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to happen and
the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock him points or
would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
Given that the excluded Schumacher from the results of the WDC in
1997, there is clearly precedent (and presumably a rule) that would
allow them to do the same to Verstappen if they judged he
deliberately took himself and Hamilton out.
And with all of the telemetry available to them, the stewards would
be in a very good position to judge whether or not it was deliberate.
...and yet Brasil. If they allow a driver to deliberately run another
off the track without consequences how
do they measure how deliberate a move is just because say, the other
driver is less able to avoid contact. What is the standard penalty for causing a collision?
On 2021-12-06 2:18 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 1:41 a.m., Martin Harran wrote:
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to
happen and the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock
him points or would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
Given that the excluded Schumacher from the results of the WDC in
1997, there is clearly precedent (and presumably a rule) that
would allow them to do the same to Verstappen if they judged he deliberately took himself and Hamilton out.
And with all of the telemetry available to them, the stewards
would be in a very good position to judge whether or not it was deliberate.
...and yet Brasil. If they allow a driver to deliberately run
another off the track without consequences how
do they measure how deliberate a move is just because say, the other
driver is less able to avoid contact. What is the standard penalty
for causing a collision?
I agree that the stewards missed the penalty that should have been
applied to Verstappen there.
That doesn't mean they're not going to act when one driver
deliberately takes out his opponent.
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 2:18 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 1:41 a.m., Martin Harran wrote:
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to
happen and the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock
him points or would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
Given that the excluded Schumacher from the results of the WDC in
1997, there is clearly precedent (and presumably a rule) that
would allow them to do the same to Verstappen if they judged he
deliberately took himself and Hamilton out.
And with all of the telemetry available to them, the stewards
would be in a very good position to judge whether or not it was
deliberate.
...and yet Brasil. If they allow a driver to deliberately run
another off the track without consequences how
do they measure how deliberate a move is just because say, the other
driver is less able to avoid contact. What is the standard penalty
for causing a collision?
I agree that the stewards missed the penalty that should have been
applied to Verstappen there.
That doesn't mean they're not going to act when one driver
deliberately takes out his opponent.
It makes it much harder to "prove" and justify an extraordinary
penalty. What would have been a fairly obvious deliberate collision
just because "causing a collision".
Take Brasil: Verstappen prioritised obstructing Hamilton over staying
on track and the stewards were okay with that.
Having not been
penalised for doing it then Max drove in the same way in Saudi.
If
there is a collision driving in what is regarded as a legitimate manner
the driver at fault is penalised for "causing a collision". If they had penalised/outlawed driving in that manner then any collision could be considered more a deliberate act.
Perhaps analogous to say an accident
blacks pot where they lower the speed limit. Before they lower the
limit an innocuous accident is just an accident when they lower the
limit the same accident someone is at fault for speeding and blame can
be assigned and someone made accountable. If the analogy doesn't help
you understand the difference then ignore it.
On 2021-12-07 3:05 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 2:18 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 1:41 a.m., Martin Harran wrote:
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi?-a If it were to
happen and the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock
him points or would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
Given that the excluded Schumacher from the results of the WDC in
1997, there is clearly precedent (and presumably a rule) that
would allow them to do the same to Verstappen if they judged he
deliberately took himself and Hamilton out.
And with all of the telemetry available to them, the stewards
would be in a very good position to judge whether or not it was
deliberate.
...and yet Brasil. If they allow a driver to deliberately run
another off the track without consequences how
do they measure how deliberate a move is just because say, the other
driver is less able to avoid contact. What is the standard penalty
for causing a collision?
I agree that the stewards missed the penalty that should have been
applied to Verstappen there.
That doesn't mean they're not going to act when one driver
deliberately takes out his opponent.
It makes it much harder to "prove" and justify an extraordinary
penalty. What would have been a fairly obvious deliberate collision
just because "causing a collision".
Take Brasil: Verstappen prioritised obstructing Hamilton over staying
on track and the stewards were okay with that.
And they made a big mistake there. I've said so. But not because
Verstappen "prioritised obstructing Hamilton over staying on track".
Verstappen left the track only because of understeer his car suddenly
picked up mostly likely because of turbulence from Hamilton's Mercedes.
On 8/12/2021 10:49 am, Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-07 3:05 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 2:18 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 1:41 a.m., Martin Harran wrote:
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi?-a If it were to
happen and the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock
him points or would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
Given that the excluded Schumacher from the results of the WDC in
1997, there is clearly precedent (and presumably a rule) that
would allow them to do the same to Verstappen if they judged he
deliberately took himself and Hamilton out.
And with all of the telemetry available to them, the stewards
would be in a very good position to judge whether or not it was
deliberate.
...and yet Brasil. If they allow a driver to deliberately run
another off the track without consequences how
do they measure how deliberate a move is just because say, the other >>>>> driver is less able to avoid contact. What is the standard penalty
for causing a collision?
I agree that the stewards missed the penalty that should have been
applied to Verstappen there.
That doesn't mean they're not going to act when one driver
deliberately takes out his opponent.
It makes it much harder to "prove" and justify an extraordinary
penalty. What would have been a fairly obvious deliberate collision
just because "causing a collision".
Take Brasil: Verstappen prioritised obstructing Hamilton over staying
on track and the stewards were okay with that.
And they made a big mistake there. I've said so. But not because
Verstappen "prioritised obstructing Hamilton over staying on track".
Verstappen left the track only because of understeer his car suddenly
picked up mostly likely because of turbulence from Hamilton's Mercedes.
Which was predictable and inevitable given the proximity, the speed, and
the line.
Did you notice how Martin Brundle didn't pick up on that being the cause despite seeing several replays?
I'm amazed how so many of you can be so certain about this stuff, when
real experts (not me!) can't be anywhere NEAR as certain.
On 8/12/2021 2:29 pm, Alan wrote:
Did you notice how Martin Brundle didn't pick up on that being the
cause despite seeing several replays?
I'm amazed how so many of you can be so certain about this stuff, when
real experts (not me!) can't be anywhere NEAR as certain.
Rather selective about which of Brundle's comments or lack of we pick up
on of refute, aren't we.
On 2021-12-07 3:05 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 2:18 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 1:41 a.m., Martin Harran wrote:
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to
happen and the stewards decide he is at fault, could they dock
him points or would he automatically become WDC irrespective?
Given that the excluded Schumacher from the results of the WDC in
1997, there is clearly precedent (and presumably a rule) that
would allow them to do the same to Verstappen if they judged he
deliberately took himself and Hamilton out.
And with all of the telemetry available to them, the stewards
would be in a very good position to judge whether or not it was
deliberate.
...and yet Brasil. If they allow a driver to deliberately run
another off the track without consequences how
do they measure how deliberate a move is just because say, the other
driver is less able to avoid contact. What is the standard penalty
for causing a collision?
I agree that the stewards missed the penalty that should have been
applied to Verstappen there.
That doesn't mean they're not going to act when one driver
deliberately takes out his opponent.
It makes it much harder to "prove" and justify an extraordinary
penalty. What would have been a fairly obvious deliberate collision
just because "causing a collision".
Take Brasil: Verstappen prioritised obstructing Hamilton over stayingAnd they made a big mistake there. I've said so. But not because
on track and the stewards were okay with that.
Verstappen "prioritised obstructing Hamilton over staying on track".
Verstappen left the track only because of understeer his car suddenly
picked up mostly likely because of turbulence from Hamilton's Mercedes.
If anything, I think what prevented them from penalizing Verstappen in
that instance was that looking at the data, they couldn't see anything
overt that Verstappen did; no steering input or pedal input that could account for it.
So without any basis for any particular action of Verstappen's to pin
the excursion on, they chose not to impose a penalty.
Having not beenNo. His driving incidents in Saudi weren't the same except for the last
penalised for doing it then Max drove in the same way in Saudi.
one. And once the stewards saw the data, they imposed a penalty for it.
That's the point: they had the data to show an overt act.
If
there is a collision driving in what is regarded as a legitimate manner the driver at fault is penalised for "causing a collision". If they had penalised/outlawed driving in that manner then any collision could be considered more a deliberate act.
Perhaps analogous to say an accident
blacks pot where they lower the speed limit. Before they lower the
limit an innocuous accident is just an accident when they lower the
limit the same accident someone is at fault for speeding and blame can
be assigned and someone made accountable. If the analogy doesn't help
you understand the difference then ignore it.
On 2021-12-07 3:05 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 2:18 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 1:41 a.m., Martin Harran wrote:
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to
happen and the stewards decide he is at fault, could they
dock him points or would he automatically become WDC
irrespective?
Given that the excluded Schumacher from the results of the
WDC in 1997, there is clearly precedent (and presumably a
rule) that would allow them to do the same to Verstappen if
they judged he deliberately took himself and Hamilton out.
And with all of the telemetry available to them, the stewards
would be in a very good position to judge whether or not it
was deliberate.
...and yet Brasil. If they allow a driver to deliberately run
another off the track without consequences how
do they measure how deliberate a move is just because say, the
other driver is less able to avoid contact. What is the
standard penalty for causing a collision?
I agree that the stewards missed the penalty that should have been applied to Verstappen there.
That doesn't mean they're not going to act when one driver
deliberately takes out his opponent.
It makes it much harder to "prove" and justify an extraordinary
penalty. What would have been a fairly obvious deliberate collision
just because "causing a collision".
Take Brasil: Verstappen prioritised obstructing Hamilton over
staying on track and the stewards were okay with that.
And they made a big mistake there. I've said so. But not because
Verstappen "prioritised obstructing Hamilton over staying on track".
Verstappen left the track only because of understeer his car suddenly
picked up mostly likely because of turbulence from Hamilton's
Mercedes.
If anything, I think what prevented them from penalizing Verstappen
in that instance was that looking at the data, they couldn't see
anything overt that Verstappen did; no steering input or pedal input
that could account for it.
So without any basis for any particular action of Verstappen's to pin
the excursion on, they chose not to impose a penalty.
Having not been
penalised for doing it then Max drove in the same way in Saudi.
No. His driving incidents in Saudi weren't the same except for the
last one. And once the stewards saw the data, they imposed a penalty
for it.
That's the point: they had the data to show an overt act.
If
there is a collision driving in what is regarded as a legitimate
manner the driver at fault is penalised for "causing a collision".
If they had penalised/outlawed driving in that manner then any
collision could be considered more a deliberate act.
Perhaps analogous to say an accident
blacks pot where they lower the speed limit. Before they lower the
limit an innocuous accident is just an accident when they lower the
limit the same accident someone is at fault for speeding and blame
can be assigned and someone made accountable. If the analogy
doesn't help you understand the difference then ignore it.
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-07 3:05 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 2:18 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 1:41 a.m., Martin Harran wrote:
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were to
happen and the stewards decide he is at fault, could they
dock him points or would he automatically become WDC
irrespective?
Given that the excluded Schumacher from the results of the
WDC in 1997, there is clearly precedent (and presumably a
rule) that would allow them to do the same to Verstappen if
they judged he deliberately took himself and Hamilton out.
And with all of the telemetry available to them, the stewards
would be in a very good position to judge whether or not it
was deliberate.
...and yet Brasil. If they allow a driver to deliberately run
another off the track without consequences how
do they measure how deliberate a move is just because say, the
other driver is less able to avoid contact. What is the
standard penalty for causing a collision?
I agree that the stewards missed the penalty that should have been
applied to Verstappen there.
That doesn't mean they're not going to act when one driver
deliberately takes out his opponent.
It makes it much harder to "prove" and justify an extraordinary
penalty. What would have been a fairly obvious deliberate collision
just because "causing a collision".
Take Brasil: Verstappen prioritised obstructing Hamilton over
staying on track and the stewards were okay with that.
And they made a big mistake there. I've said so. But not because
Verstappen "prioritised obstructing Hamilton over staying on track".
Verstappen left the track only because of understeer his car suddenly
picked up mostly likely because of turbulence from Hamilton's
Mercedes.
If anything, I think what prevented them from penalizing Verstappen
in that instance was that looking at the data, they couldn't see
anything overt that Verstappen did; no steering input or pedal input
that could account for it.
So without any basis for any particular action of Verstappen's to pin
the excursion on, they chose not to impose a penalty.
More of your conclusion driven guess work.
Occam's razor: He understeered because he braked "almost precisely" a
track width later and was on a dirty part of the track. continued to understeer because he got on the throttle before it was under control.
Having not been
penalised for doing it then Max drove in the same way in Saudi.
No. His driving incidents in Saudi weren't the same except for the
last one. And once the stewards saw the data, they imposed a penalty
for it.
Your highly subjective opinion was precisely refuted by real experts.
See Jolyon Palmer for instance.
That's the point: they had the data to show an overt act.
What point? You have made no point. You have simply ignored all the
points. Almost precisely as if you don't want to consider them... or
don't have the intelligence to do so.
You don't have much attention span, do you?
You don't have much attention span, do you?
On Wednesday, December 8, 2021 at 10:10:37 AM UTC-7, Alan wrote:
You don't have much attention span, do you?
yet you can suck cock for a hour non stop
you stupid cunt
On 2021-12-08 2:23 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-07 3:05 a.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 2:18 p.m., Bigbird wrote:
Alan wrote:
On 2021-12-06 1:41 a.m., Martin Harran wrote:
rCa Max takes out both of them in Abu Dhabi? If it were
to happen and the stewards decide he is at fault, could
they dock him points or would he automatically become
WDC irrespective?
Given that the excluded Schumacher from the results of the
WDC in 1997, there is clearly precedent (and presumably a
rule) that would allow them to do the same to Verstappen
if they judged he deliberately took himself and Hamilton
out.
And with all of the telemetry available to them, the
stewards would be in a very good position to judge
whether or not it was deliberate.
...and yet Brasil. If they allow a driver to deliberately
run another off the track without consequences how
do they measure how deliberate a move is just because say,
the other driver is less able to avoid contact. What is the standard penalty for causing a collision?
I agree that the stewards missed the penalty that should have
been applied to Verstappen there.
That doesn't mean they're not going to act when one driver deliberately takes out his opponent.
It makes it much harder to "prove" and justify an extraordinary penalty. What would have been a fairly obvious deliberate
collision just because "causing a collision".
Take Brasil: Verstappen prioritised obstructing Hamilton over
staying on track and the stewards were okay with that.
And they made a big mistake there. I've said so. But not because Verstappen "prioritised obstructing Hamilton over staying on
track".
Verstappen left the track only because of understeer his car
suddenly picked up mostly likely because of turbulence from
Hamilton's Mercedes.
If anything, I think what prevented them from penalizing
Verstappen in that instance was that looking at the data, they
couldn't see anything overt that Verstappen did; no steering
input or pedal input that could account for it.
So without any basis for any particular action of Verstappen's to
pin the excursion on, they chose not to impose a penalty.
More of your conclusion driven guess work.
Occam's razor: He understeered because he braked "almost precisely"
a track width later and was on a dirty part of the track. continued
to understeer because he got on the throttle before it was under
control.
Completely and utterly wrong.
Because that inside line wasn't that dirty.
We know this because on
another lap, Verstappen was on precisely that piece of track and
DIDN'T understeer.
And he only got on the throttle once he realized that:
1. His trajectory was now taking him off the track.
2. Getting on the throttle wouldn't carry him beyond the paved
off-track area.
Having not been
penalised for doing it then Max drove in the same way in Saudi.
No. His driving incidents in Saudi weren't the same except for the
last one. And once the stewards saw the data, they imposed a
penalty for it.
Your highly subjective opinion was precisely refuted by real
experts.
See Jolyon Palmer for instance.
Sorry, if you think Palmer has something to say which refutes what
I've said...
...present it.
That's the point: they had the data to show an overt act.
What point? You have made no point. You have simply ignored all the
points. Almost precisely as if you don't want to consider them... or
don't have the intelligence to do so.
You don't have much attention span, do you?
The best driver wins :-)
The best driver wins :-)
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