So Jose's Spurs are top of the league after a convincing Mourinho-like performance against ManCity.
Meaning that Mou could be on track to winning a championship with a fifth different team: Porto, Chelsea, Real Madrid and Spurs, and let's assume for a second that the one with the Immaculate Virgins also counts.
We did this not too long ago for managers winning in four or more different leagues, and there are six coaches that belong in this group: Mourinho (4 different teams), Trap (5), Ancelotti (4), Happel (4), Ivic (5), and Gerets (6) .
On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 6:26:12 PM UTC-5, Futbolmetrix wrote:
So Jose's Spurs are top of the league after a convincing Mourinho-like performance against ManCity.
Meaning that Mou could be on track to winning a championship with a fifth different team: Porto, Chelsea, Real Madrid and Spurs, and let's assume for a second that the one with the Immaculate Virgins also counts.
We did this not too long ago for managers winning in four or more different leagues, and there are six coaches that belong in this group: Mourinho (4 different teams), Trap (5), Ancelotti (4), Happel (4), Ivic (5), and Gerets (6) .
Real Madrid captures the 2021-2022 La Liga title, and Ancelotti becomes the first manager to win in each one of the top 5 leagues. Best superstar manager out there?
On 2022-04-30 11:05, Futbolmetrix wrote:Agreed.
I dunno, his record of winning league titles, given that he has managed
so many elite teams, is not all that impressive.
So 5 titles, one in each league, in about 20 years of coaching eliteWhat I meant to say was "manager of superstars", rather than superstar manager. He's been very good at getting teams full of egos to row in the same direction. I guess this is in part because, contrary to gurus such as Guardiola or Klopp, he is not fixated on a particular style of play, and is happy to just let the players do their thing.
teams with reasonable expectations of winning their league.
I don't think that alone qualifies him as a superstar manager.
So even though he has gone way up in my estimation since announcing heIn Ancelotti's defense, one could argue that his titles at Milan and Chelsea were not necessarily a sure thing at the start of the season (even though, with the team Milan had at its disposal in the early 00s, he really should have done a lot better than just one league title)
will be supporting Canada in the World Club, I can't see him as the
"best superstar manager out there" quite yet. In fact if Pep can win
the title and CL this year, he looks far more successful, and in a
shorter time, than Ancelotti (3 CLs, 3 BL, 3 Liga, 4 EPLs - again though with the caveat that he has been privileged to manage elite teams that
start every year with an expectation that they win the league).
On Sunday, December 13, 2020 at 7:07:40 PM UTC+1, vedran wrote:A bit spooky that this thread was being resurrected just the other day, because :'-(
On 23.11.2020. 23:52, Werner Pichler wrote:
Lower-hanging fruit, but Otto Bari|a won the Austrian League with Innsbruck, Rapid and Austria Salzburg.
(+1 Croatian title with Dinamo Zagreb, reached two European finals, came very close to another Austrian title with Sturm Graz)
Otto Baric just passed away, due to covid complications apparently. Despite his age he was more than reasonable, was a guest at
Podcast Inkubator this year
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZYllyOq5FU
Very sad news.
He was one of the defining figures in Austrian football for 30 years, his manners and typical quotes
have achieved legendary status here (warranting his nickname 'Otto Maximale'). The 2000's were
a bit marred by his ill-advised homophobic comments, but in retrospect it's become clear how unique
his accomplishments were (the above mentioned titles with three different teams, European finals
with Rapid and Salzburg, taking Austria closer to the World Cup than anyone since 1998). RIP.
Now I just pray that Osim holds on for many, many more years, because that'll be the day I'll shed actual tears.
On 2022-04-30 11:05, Futbolmetrix wrote:
On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 6:26:12 PM UTC-5, Futbolmetrix wrote:
So Jose's Spurs are top of the league after a convincing Mourinho-like performance against ManCity.
Meaning that Mou could be on track to winning a championship with a fifth different team: Porto, Chelsea, Real Madrid and Spurs, and let's assume for a second that the one with the Immaculate Virgins also counts.
We did this not too long ago for managers winning in four or more different leagues, and there are six coaches that belong in this group: Mourinho (4 different teams), Trap (5), Ancelotti (4), Happel (4), Ivic (5), and Gerets (6) .
Real Madrid captures the 2021-2022 La Liga title, and Ancelotti becomes the first manager to win in each one of the top 5 leagues. Best superstar manager out there?
I dunno, his record of winning league titles, given that he has managed
so many elite teams, is not all that impressive. Has anyone ever done a "wins over replacement" type analysis for him.
He managed only 50 % title wins with PSG (surely that compares
unfavourably to just about everyone else they have had since they
started their run of winning the title most of the time).
0 titles in 2 years with Juve
1 title in 8 years with Milan
1 title in 2 years with Chelsea
1 title in 2 years with PSG.
1 title in 3 years with Real Madrid
1 in 1.5 years with Bayern (fired halfway through second)
0 titles with Napoli
On Saturday, April 30, 2022 at 1:31:00 PM UTC-4, MH wrote:
On 2022-04-30 11:05, Futbolmetrix wrote:
On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 6:26:12 PM UTC-5, Futbolmetrix wrote:
So Jose's Spurs are top of the league after a convincing Mourinho-like performance against ManCity.
Meaning that Mou could be on track to winning a championship with a fifth different team: Porto, Chelsea, Real Madrid and Spurs, and let's assume for a second that the one with the Immaculate Virgins also counts.
We did this not too long ago for managers winning in four or more different leagues, and there are six coaches that belong in this group: Mourinho (4 different teams), Trap (5), Ancelotti (4), Happel (4), Ivic (5), and Gerets (6) .
Real Madrid captures the 2021-2022 La Liga title, and Ancelotti becomes the first manager to win in each one of the top 5 leagues. Best superstar manager out there?
I dunno, his record of winning league titles, given that he has managed
so many elite teams, is not all that impressive. Has anyone ever done a "wins over replacement" type analysis for him.
He managed only 50 % title wins with PSG (surely that compares unfavourably to just about everyone else they have had since they
started their run of winning the title most of the time).
0 titles in 2 years with JuveThey won teh title the season before he joined. They finished 7th in his first season. Not too impressive.
1 title in 8 years with MilanBelow expectations (his CL exploits were very solid though).
1 title in 2 years with ChelseaEPL was a 2 team league then, so about in line with minimum expectations.
1 title in 2 years with PSG.Minimum expectation, maybe even below expectations seeing their financial might.
1 title in 3 years with Real MadridBarely meeting expectations (won CL, though they were rather fortunate to do so).
1 in 1.5 years with Bayern (fired halfway through second)Meh.
0 titles with Napoli
Underwhelming. Same with Everton.
Bottom line: Ancelotti never had a team punching above its weight.
Now I just pray that Osim holds on for many, many more years, because that'll be the day I'll shed actual tears.A bit spooky that this thread was being resurrected just the other day, because :'-(
On Saturday, April 30, 2022 at 1:31:00 PM UTC-4, MH wrote:
On 2022-04-30 11:05, Futbolmetrix wrote:
On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 6:26:12 PM UTC-5, Futbolmetrix wrote:
So Jose's Spurs are top of the league after a convincing Mourinho-like performance against ManCity.
Meaning that Mou could be on track to winning a championship with a fifth different team: Porto, Chelsea, Real Madrid and Spurs, and let's assume for a second that the one with the Immaculate Virgins also counts.
We did this not too long ago for managers winning in four or more different leagues, and there are six coaches that belong in this group: Mourinho (4 different teams), Trap (5), Ancelotti (4), Happel (4), Ivic (5), and Gerets (6) .
Real Madrid captures the 2021-2022 La Liga title, and Ancelotti becomes the first manager to win in each one of the top 5 leagues. Best superstar manager out there?
I dunno, his record of winning league titles, given that he has managed
so many elite teams, is not all that impressive. Has anyone ever done a "wins over replacement" type analysis for him.
He managed only 50 % title wins with PSG (surely that compares unfavourably to just about everyone else they have had since they
started their run of winning the title most of the time).
0 titles in 2 years with JuveThey won teh title the season before he joined. They finished 7th in his first season. Not too impressive.
1 title in 8 years with MilanBelow expectations (his CL exploits were very solid though).
1 title in 2 years with ChelseaEPL was a 2 team league then, so about in line with minimum expectations.
--- SBBSecho 3.06-Win321 title in 2 years with PSG.Minimum expectation, maybe even below expectations seeing their financial might.
1 title in 3 years with Real MadridBarely meeting expectations (won CL, though they were rather fortunate to do so).
1 in 1.5 years with Bayern (fired halfway through second)Meh.
0 titles with Napoli
Underwhelming. Same with Everton.
Bottom line: Ancelotti never had a team punching above its weight.
Not entirely Ancelotti's fault, though, as he came in mid-season to replace Lippi who had lost control of the dressing room. Also, this was the year that Del Piero tore his ACL, and Zinedine "only ever showed 75% of his true potential at Juve" Zidane couldn't pick up the slack. Anyway, most Juve fans don't have a very fond memory of Ancelotti:0 titles in 2 years with JuveThey won teh title the season before he joined. They finished 7th in his first season. Not too impressive.
Bottom line: Ancelotti never had a team punching above its weight.Agreed. But if you look at his ClubElo profile, he seems to have a good knack of taking over very good teams, keeping them close to their level, and leaving before they fall even further.
On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 6:26:12 PM UTC-5, Futbolmetrix wrote:
So Jose's Spurs are top of the league after a convincing Mourinho-like performance against ManCity.
Meaning that Mou could be on track to winning a championship with a fifth different team: Porto, Chelsea, Real Madrid and Spurs, and let's assume for a second that the one with the Immaculate Virgins also
counts.
We did this not too long ago for managers winning in four or more different leagues, and there are six coaches that belong in this group: Mourinho (4 different teams), Trap (5), Ancelotti (4), Happel (4), Ivic (5), and
Gerets (6) .
Real Madrid captures the 2021-2022 La Liga title, and Ancelotti becomes the first manager to win in each one of the top 5 leagues. Best superstar manager out there?
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 5:19:46 PM UTC+2, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
On Saturday, April 30, 2022 at 1:31:00 PM UTC-4, MH wrote:
On 2022-04-30 11:05, Futbolmetrix wrote:
On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 6:26:12 PM UTC-5, Futbolmetrix wrote:
So Jose's Spurs are top of the league after a convincing Mourinho-like performance against ManCity.
Meaning that Mou could be on track to winning a championship with a fifth different team: Porto, Chelsea, Real Madrid and Spurs, and let's assume for a second that the one with the Immaculate Virgins also counts.
We did this not too long ago for managers winning in four or more different leagues, and there are six coaches that belong in this group: Mourinho (4 different teams), Trap (5), Ancelotti (4), Happel (4), Ivic (5), and Gerets (6) .
Real Madrid captures the 2021-2022 La Liga title, and Ancelotti becomes the first manager to win in each one of the top 5 leagues. Best superstar manager out there?
I dunno, his record of winning league titles, given that he has managed so many elite teams, is not all that impressive. Has anyone ever done a "wins over replacement" type analysis for him.
He managed only 50 % title wins with PSG (surely that compares unfavourably to just about everyone else they have had since they started their run of winning the title most of the time).
0 titles in 2 years with JuveThey won teh title the season before he joined. They finished 7th in his first season. Not too impressive.
1 title in 8 years with MilanBelow expectations (his CL exploits were very solid though).
The EPL is a 2 team league right now as well, and Klopp's honor list might look quite similar.1 title in 2 years with ChelseaEPL was a 2 team league then, so about in line with minimum expectations.
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 11:19:46 AM UTC-4, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:I think we all agree that Ancelotti does well when he inherits a privileged situation.
Not entirely Ancelotti's fault, though, as he came in mid-season to replace Lippi who had lost control of the dressing room. Also, this was the year that Del Piero tore his ACL, and Zinedine "only ever showed 75% of his true potential at Juve" Zidane couldn't pick up the slack. Anyway, most Juve fans don't have a very fond memory of Ancelotti:0 titles in 2 years with JuveThey won teh title the season before he joined. They finished 7th in his first season. Not too impressive.
- Squandered 2-0 lead at home to Man U in the CL semifinal return leg.
- Never really understood Henry's talent, played him at left wing-back and then agreed to let him go to Arsenal for peanuts.
- Lost the 1999-2000 title to Lazio, after squandering a 9-point lead with 9 (?) matches to go, and a 5 point lead with 3 matches left. His insistence in the final stretch on Del Piero and Inzaghi, who had run out of steam and didn't see eye to eye, was a killer.
- Started very poorly the 2000-2001 season, and left himself too much of a mountain to climb. Still, we could have made a comeback, but in the key match against Roma (5 matches to go, six points behind), we once again couldn't hold on to a 2-0 lead.
Bottom line: Ancelotti never had a team punching above its weight.Agreed. But if you look at his ClubElo profile, he seems to have a good knack of taking over very good teams, keeping them close to their level, and leaving before they fall even further.
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 12:36:56 PM UTC-4, Futbolmetrix wrote:I would amend that to 'better than most'.
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 11:19:46 AM UTC-4, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
Not entirely Ancelotti's fault, though, as he came in mid-season to replace Lippi who had lost control of the dressing room. Also, this was the year that Del Piero tore his ACL, and Zinedine "only ever showed 75% of his true potential at Juve" Zidane couldn't pick up the slack. Anyway, most Juve fans don't have a very fond memory of Ancelotti:0 titles in 2 years with JuveThey won teh title the season before he joined. They finished 7th in his first season. Not too impressive.
- Squandered 2-0 lead at home to Man U in the CL semifinal return leg.
- Never really understood Henry's talent, played him at left wing-back and then agreed to let him go to Arsenal for peanuts.
- Lost the 1999-2000 title to Lazio, after squandering a 9-point lead with 9 (?) matches to go, and a 5 point lead with 3 matches left. His insistence in the final stretch on Del Piero and Inzaghi, who had run out of steam and didn't see eye to eye, was a killer.
- Started very poorly the 2000-2001 season, and left himself too much of a mountain to climb. Still, we could have made a comeback, but in the key match against Roma (5 matches to go, six points behind), we once again couldn't hold on to a 2-0 lead.
Bottom line: Ancelotti never had a team punching above its weight.Agreed. But if you look at his ClubElo profile, he seems to have a good knack of taking over very good teams, keeping them close to their level, and leaving before they fall even further.
I think we all agree that Ancelotti does well when he inherits a privileged situation.
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 12:29:17 PM UTC-4, Werner Pichler wrote:
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 5:19:46 PM UTC+2, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
On Saturday, April 30, 2022 at 1:31:00 PM UTC-4, MH wrote:
On 2022-04-30 11:05, Futbolmetrix wrote:
On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 6:26:12 PM UTC-5, Futbolmetrix wrote:
So Jose's Spurs are top of the league after a convincing Mourinho-like performance against ManCity.
Meaning that Mou could be on track to winning a championship with a fifth different team: Porto, Chelsea, Real Madrid and Spurs, and let's assume for a second that the one with the Immaculate Virgins also counts.
We did this not too long ago for managers winning in four or more different leagues, and there are six coaches that belong in this group: Mourinho (4 different teams), Trap (5), Ancelotti (4), Happel (4), Ivic (5), and Gerets (6) .
Real Madrid captures the 2021-2022 La Liga title, and Ancelotti becomes the first manager to win in each one of the top 5 leagues. Best superstar manager out there?
I dunno, his record of winning league titles, given that he has managed
so many elite teams, is not all that impressive. Has anyone ever done a
"wins over replacement" type analysis for him.
He managed only 50 % title wins with PSG (surely that compares unfavourably to just about everyone else they have had since they started their run of winning the title most of the time).
0 titles in 2 years with JuveThey won teh title the season before he joined. They finished 7th in his first season. Not too impressive.
1 title in 8 years with MilanBelow expectations (his CL exploits were very solid though).
The EPL is a 2 team league right now as well, and Klopp's honor list might look quite similar.1 title in 2 years with ChelseaEPL was a 2 team league then, so about in line with minimum expectations.
Is that a sincere comparison, or are you just being mischievous?
Because I am pretty sure that you realize that there's a bit of a difference in the situations these two coaches inherited at their respective EPL clubs.
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 6:59:44 PM UTC+2, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:Honestly, and without trying to sound like I'm trolling, being a homer, or indulging in hyperbole, Ancelotti and Tuchel don't even belong in the same breath as Klopp.
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 12:29:17 PM UTC-4, Werner Pichler wrote:
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 5:19:46 PM UTC+2, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
On Saturday, April 30, 2022 at 1:31:00 PM UTC-4, MH wrote:
On 2022-04-30 11:05, Futbolmetrix wrote:
On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 6:26:12 PM UTC-5, Futbolmetrix wrote:
So Jose's Spurs are top of the league after a convincing Mourinho-like performance against ManCity.
Meaning that Mou could be on track to winning a championship with a fifth different team: Porto, Chelsea, Real Madrid and Spurs, and let's assume for a second that the one with the Immaculate Virgins also counts.
We did this not too long ago for managers winning in four or more different leagues, and there are six coaches that belong in this group: Mourinho (4 different teams), Trap (5), Ancelotti (4), Happel (4), Ivic (5), and Gerets (6) .
Real Madrid captures the 2021-2022 La Liga title, and Ancelotti becomes the first manager to win in each one of the top 5 leagues. Best superstar manager out there?
I dunno, his record of winning league titles, given that he has managed
so many elite teams, is not all that impressive. Has anyone ever done a
"wins over replacement" type analysis for him.
He managed only 50 % title wins with PSG (surely that compares unfavourably to just about everyone else they have had since they started their run of winning the title most of the time).
0 titles in 2 years with JuveThey won teh title the season before he joined. They finished 7th in his first season. Not too impressive.
1 title in 8 years with MilanBelow expectations (his CL exploits were very solid though).
The EPL is a 2 team league right now as well, and Klopp's honor list might look quite similar.1 title in 2 years with ChelseaEPL was a 2 team league then, so about in line with minimum expectations.
Is that a sincere comparison, or are you just being mischievous?Bit of both. You worship Klopp, and got reasons to, but it doesn't quite square with you denigrating Tuchel and Ancelotti.
Klopp's been through his fair share of disappointments, especially in finals.A nuanced and knowledgeable fan like yourself should know better than most that cup competitions have a healthy element of luck in them.
Let's look at a list of some others who have done that:Because I am pretty sure that you realize that there's a bit of a difference in the situations these two coaches inherited at their respective EPL clubs.I guess you could say that I've come to appreciate the difficulty of getting results out of a group.
Even if, or rather especially when, they're already eminently good at what they're doing.
Even if, or rather especially when, they're already eminently good at what they're doing.
Let's look at a list of some others who have done that:
Flick - Took champions and kept them champions in both his seasons in charge, plus won the CL
Nagelsman - Took champions and conformably retained them as such
Pochettino - Same
Sarri - Same
Alegri - Took champions and kept them as such for 5 consecutive years! Vilanova, Valverde, Enrique - Same
I just listed 8 managers who took a championship team and retained it.
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 3:04:35 PM UTC-4, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
Even if, or rather especially when, they're already eminently good at what they're doing.
Let's look at a list of some others who have done that:
Flick - Took champions and kept them champions in both his seasons in charge, plus won the CL
Nagelsman - Took champions and conformably retained them as such
Pochettino - Same
Sarri - Same
Alegri - Took champions and kept them as such for 5 consecutive years!
Vilanova, Valverde, Enrique - Same
I just listed 8 managers who took a championship team and retained it.
And how many of these have done it in more than one place?
On 2022-05-01 16:13, Futbolmetrix wrote:
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 3:04:35 PM UTC-4, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
Even if, or rather especially when, they're already eminently good at what they're doing.
Let's look at a list of some others who have done that:
Flick - Took champions and kept them champions in both his seasons in charge, plus won the CL
Nagelsman - Took champions and conformably retained them as such
Pochettino - Same
Sarri - Same
Alegri - Took champions and kept them as such for 5 consecutive years!
Vilanova, Valverde, Enrique - Same
I just listed 8 managers who took a championship team and retained it.
And how many of these have done it in more than one place?
None of those, but people like Mourinho, Trapattoni and Capello haveAll from the top echelon of managers, no?
done it with multiple teams, multiple times. Hitzfeld too, I suppose.
And Conte.
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 2:09:57 PM UTC-4, Werner Pichler wrote:
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 6:59:44 PM UTC+2, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 12:29:17 PM UTC-4, Werner Pichler wrote:
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 5:19:46 PM UTC+2, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
On Saturday, April 30, 2022 at 1:31:00 PM UTC-4, MH wrote:
On 2022-04-30 11:05, Futbolmetrix wrote:
On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 6:26:12 PM UTC-5, Futbolmetrix wrote:
So Jose's Spurs are top of the league after a convincing Mourinho-like performance against ManCity.
Meaning that Mou could be on track to winning a championship with a fifth different team: Porto, Chelsea, Real Madrid and Spurs, and let's assume for a second that the one with the Immaculate Virgins also counts.
We did this not too long ago for managers winning in four or more different leagues, and there are six coaches that belong in this group: Mourinho (4 different teams), Trap (5), Ancelotti (4), Happel (4), Ivic (5), and Gerets (6) .
Real Madrid captures the 2021-2022 La Liga title, and Ancelotti becomes the first manager to win in each one of the top 5 leagues. Best superstar manager out there?
I dunno, his record of winning league titles, given that he has managed
so many elite teams, is not all that impressive. Has anyone ever done a
"wins over replacement" type analysis for him.
He managed only 50 % title wins with PSG (surely that compares unfavourably to just about everyone else they have had since they started their run of winning the title most of the time).
0 titles in 2 years with JuveThey won teh title the season before he joined. They finished 7th in his first season. Not too impressive.
1 title in 8 years with MilanBelow expectations (his CL exploits were very solid though).
The EPL is a 2 team league right now as well, and Klopp's honor list might look quite similar.1 title in 2 years with ChelseaEPL was a 2 team league then, so about in line with minimum expectations.
Honestly, and without trying to sound like I'm trolling, being a homer, or indulging in hyperbole, Ancelotti and Tuchel don't even belong in the same breath as Klopp.Is that a sincere comparison, or are you just being mischievous?Bit of both. You worship Klopp, and got reasons to, but it doesn't quite square with you denigrating Tuchel and Ancelotti.
Klopp has exceeded expectations everywhere he has ever managed. He took Mainz to the Bundesliga for the first in their history (I think), won two Bundesliga
titles with Dortmund and got to the CL final with a budget a fraction of Bayern's, and took Liverpool out of the gutter and molded arguably their greatest side in
history (with a net spend lower than West Ham, Aston Villa, and Everton in that same period). It's astounding what he has done at LFC.
Klopp's been through his fair share of disappointments, especially in finals.
A nuanced and knowledgeable fan like yourself should know better than most that cup competitions have a healthy element of luck in them.
Because I am pretty sure that you realize that there's a bit of a difference in the situations these two coaches inherited at their respective EPL clubs.I guess you could say that I've come to appreciate the difficulty of getting results out of a group.
Even if, or rather especially when, they're already eminently good at what they're doing.
Let's look at a list of some others who have done that:
Flick - Took champions and kept them champions in both his seasons in charge, plus won the CL
Nagelsman - Took champions and conformably retained them as such
Pochettino - Same
Sarri - Same
Alegri - Took champions and kept them as such for 5 consecutive years!
Vilanova, Valverde, Enrique - Same
I just listed 8 managers who took a championship team and retained it. None of the names above are mentioned as some of the greatest managers of recent
times. Maybe continuing to get results out of a dominant and successful group isn't as hard as you think it is.
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 3:04:35 PM UTC-4, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
Even if, or rather especially when, they're already eminently good at what they're doing.
Let's look at a list of some others who have done that:
Flick - Took champions and kept them champions in both his seasons in charge, plus won the CL
Nagelsman - Took champions and conformably retained them as such Pochettino - Same
Sarri - Same
Alegri - Took champions and kept them as such for 5 consecutive years! Vilanova, Valverde, Enrique - Same
I just listed 8 managers who took a championship team and retained it.And how many of these have done it in more than one place?
On Monday, May 2, 2022 at 6:43:27 AM UTC+2, MH wrote:
On 2022-05-01 16:13, Futbolmetrix wrote:
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 3:04:35 PM UTC-4, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
Even if, or rather especially when, they're already eminently good at what they're doing.
Let's look at a list of some others who have done that:
Flick - Took champions and kept them champions in both his seasons in charge, plus won the CL
Nagelsman - Took champions and conformably retained them as such
Pochettino - Same
Sarri - Same
Alegri - Took champions and kept them as such for 5 consecutive years! >> Vilanova, Valverde, Enrique - Same
I just listed 8 managers who took a championship team and retained it.
And how many of these have done it in more than one place?
I don't think it has ever been in dispute that Ancelotti is in the top echelon of managers. It's his reputation as one of the very best that I take strong exception to. In my opinion the 4 greatest managers of this millennium are Ferguson, Mourinho, Guardiola, and Klopp, with an honorable mention for Conte. These are guys who have elevated their teams (and individual players) to new heights, on a consistent basis.None of those, but people like Mourinho, Trapattoni and Capello haveAll from the top echelon of managers, no?
done it with multiple teams, multiple times. Hitzfeld too, I suppose.
And Conte.
Whoa...you are wading into dangerous culture/generational war territory within the Juve fandom...Sarri - SameI'll leave it to Daniele to judge whether or not he's to be blamed for Juve's subsequent problems after the 19/20 title.
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 6:13:04 PM UTC-4, Futbolmetrix wrote:
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 3:04:35 PM UTC-4, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
And how many of these have done it in more than one place?Even if, or rather especially when, they're already eminently good at what they're doing.
Let's look at a list of some others who have done that:
Flick - Took champions and kept them champions in both his seasons in charge, plus won the CL
Nagelsman - Took champions and conformably retained them as such
Pochettino - Same
Sarri - Same
Alegri - Took champions and kept them as such for 5 consecutive years!
Vilanova, Valverde, Enrique - Same
I just listed 8 managers who took a championship team and retained it.
I would argue that that's more a result of opportunity than anything else.
On 2022-05-02 09:04, Al Kamista wrote:
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 6:13:04 PM UTC-4, Futbolmetrix wrote:
On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 3:04:35 PM UTC-4, alka...@hotmail.com wrote:
Even if, or rather especially when, they're already eminently good at what they're doing.
Let's look at a list of some others who have done that:
Flick - Took champions and kept them champions in both his seasons in charge, plus won the CL
Nagelsman - Took champions and conformably retained them as such
Pochettino - Same
Sarri - Same
Alegri - Took champions and kept them as such for 5 consecutive years! >>> Vilanova, Valverde, Enrique - Same
I just listed 8 managers who took a championship team and retained it. >> And how many of these have done it in more than one place?
I would argue that that's more a result of opportunity than anything else.It does introduce a certain bias. Until recently (OK, recently in old
fogey relative terms), managers did not move around so much
(particularly in Britain, or so it would seem). You had people like Ron Greenwood (13 years at West Ham), Bobby Robson (13 years at Ipswich),
Keith Burkinshaw (8 years at Spurs) who did not win all that much (but
then things were also more competitive), but retained the faith of their clubs (and were not poached by bigger clubs either).
German managers going abroad was not that common with a few exceptions
like Lattek and Heynckes (and an unsuccessful Weisweiler year at Barca).
Some of the bigger Dutch ones did move a bit more, perhaps.--- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
Even more recently it seems like Italian, Portugese and Spanish managers
are more adventurous about trying their luck in new countries.
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